[00:00:00] Veronica: Hello, I’m Veronica Combs, and this is the Quantum Spin by HKA. For season four, we decided to do something a little different. In March, we attended the APS Global Physics Summit in Anaheim, California. We took advantage of this amazing event to talk to the leaders in academia, industry, as well as the creative folks who helped make the event such a compelling experience.

[00:00:23] I hope you enjoy these conversations that really reflect what’s happening in the industry right now.

[00:00:29] Today I’m talking with Michaela Eichinger from Quantum Machines. She is a product solutions physicist. Thank you very much for your time today.

[00:00:30] Quantum Machines has a team of quantum physicists, software and systems engineers, and chip designers and you make quantum control and electronic solutions. So that sounds like a lot of very complex tasks all together in one place. Tell me about what Quantum Machines does.

[00:00:53] Michaela: Yeah, we are all about hybrid control solutions for quantum computing. The term hybrid comes from combining quantum and classical workflows in a very tight and seamless way, and this is because every quantum operation will always have a classical processing part. And the problem that the industry has is, how do you actually make seamless workflows here? This is what our electronics are about. We integrate classical computing engines to have these very tight control flows between quantum and the classical world. And this is for doing pulse operations to control different kinds of qubits for readout of the sequences. So doing measurements. And then based on these measurements, we can analyze that in a very fast manner and make conditional operations. And in this case, we’re really driving the field forward because this is bringing something new to the field. And it allows you to do real time operations on fragile quantum systems.

[00:01:55] Veronica: And your background is physics?

[00:01:56] Michaela: Yes, exactly. I’m an experimental physicist. I did my PhD on a superconducting qubit platform and then afterwards I basically joined Quantum Machines as a product solution physicist.

[00:02:08] Veronica: Right. Your control systems work across different modalities then?

[00:02:11] Michaela: Yes, exactly. So, of course different modalities have different requirements. But we really built a unified system that can be used across many different modalities. And for all of these modalities, this tight quantum classical link that I talked about matters.

[00:02:28] So you want to be able to do mid circuit operations to do calibrations, to be able to compensate for any drifts in the system. And this is independent of the qubit modality you’re using. They share these sorts of properties. And that’s why our system can be used also across the board and with some of these tasks it has to happen in real time.

[00:02:50] Veronica: Right. You have to change as things are happening with the qubits.

[00:02:53] Michaela: Yes, exactly. When we say real time, I mean we can look at different kinds of real time. Typically, we are referring to the qubit coherence time. Depending on the platform, if we look at superconducting qubits, we want to be able to operate and react within nanosecond timescales and do these conditional operations.

[00:03:13] Veronica: I believe Alice & Bob is one of your customers. Is there a particular way they use your technology?

[00:03:18] Michaela: Yeah, so Alice & Bob, they focus on a technology called cat qubits. It’s a specific type of superconducting qubit, and they require very complex pulse sequences and also across multi-channels.

[00:03:31] And our control hardware makes it very easy and seamless to do these more complicated operations and in a very intuitive manner because we have our own programming language, QUA, that is used with our control hardware and it really makes programming of complex pulse sequences straightforward.

[00:03:51] You have a low overhead and you’re able to have these real time processing and these real time operations including even for these more advanced qubit modalities.

[00:04:01] Veronica: Right. And I should say, for full disclosure, that HKA also works with Alice & Bob. Their cat qubits are just an interesting modality that I wanted to discuss.

[00:04:10] I was talking to another physicist earlier this week, and he was describing quantum hardware as advanced prototypes, very advanced prototypes, but some of your products you describe as out-of-the-box workflows, which makes it sound that the abstraction level is a little higher.

[00:04:24] So I’m curious which one of your workflows are out-of-the-box?

[00:04:27] Michaela: Yeah. When we look at tuning up or operating quantum processors of any scale, mm-hmm. Typically, right now you still need PhD level scientists to get these systems up and running. And in order to bring this technology to a practical quantum advantage, we need to do something in order to fix this. And that’s what we are here for, right?

[00:04:49] We build actually a very intuitive programming language and provide also a large code base on our GitHub to make it easy for early-stage researchers or people in the industry to be able to get the system and then get to their experiment and to their tune-up in a very fast, out-of-the-box manner. So, for the typical qubit modalities, we provide these workflows. And then it’s very easy for them to get started and really have within a few days or within a day already.

[00:05:18] They’re set up. Their qubit chips are up and running and calibrated. And this is something, using some systems, they often still need days to calibrate single qubits. But with our system and with our out-of-the-box workflows this time is really cut manyfold.

[00:05:35] People are not stuck in the calibration world. They really get to their experiment and what they actually want to do faster.

[00:05:43] Veronica: And I assume at some point, maybe not right now, but these out-of-the-box workflows will be a way to bring more people into working with Quantum Machines in general.

[00:05:52] Or quantum computers, because they don’t have to know all the details. They can get started more quickly, like you said.

[00:05:57] Michaela: Definitely, it’s really for educating. We’re educating the new workforce here and students. And if I am thinking back, being a student and having something where you can orientate on where there is some coding or some software that you can utilize, I think this just helps you ease into this world of quantum computing as well.

[00:06:18] Veronica: Right, gives you a little bit of a head start or something to learn from.

[00:06:21] Michaela: Exactly. Yep.

[00:06:22] Veronica: And so, at the opposite end of the spectrum I was reading the website and you mentioned bespoke physicist support, which sounds like the perfect complement to getting started on quantum computers.

[00:06:31] Can you share an example of how one of your experts worked with a customer in that specialized way?

[00:06:35] Michaela: When somebody orders our control hardware. We always send the customer a success engineer to set up the system. This person will be there to really help them tune up their experiment and to teach them, QUA, our programming language.

[00:06:49] And this is also what you get when you order the system. So the physicists are available via multiple communication channels. You will always have the support to really make sure that your experiment is up and running.

[00:07:03] Veronica: In your position at Quantum Machines and just your perspective over the industry, are there modalities you’re keeping track of or trends or quantum sensing? Obviously, you’re seeing a little more tension and quantum networking is still coming along.

[00:07:15] I’m just curious how you look at the industry from your point of view.

[00:07:18] Michaela: Yeah, it’s very exciting to work in a startup or scale up at this point that sort of sits very uniquely in this entire ecosystem because you get this exposure to all of these modalities.

[00:07:29] And I also have many colleagues with different PhD backgrounds in these systems. I think all across the board the platforms are making great progress. So for me, I’m coming from superconducting qubits, but it’s very exciting to see what’s happening in sensing or neutral atoms and to get to know these players also in a more personal manner.

[00:07:47] Here at APS, they’re just stopping by at the booth. We’re doing live demos with them. And often, you can come up with novel new ways, how you implement techniques from like this one field in the other qubit platform.

[00:08:00] But if I’m thinking about more trends, I think everybody’s really going into this. We have the lab proof of concept and it’s really about scaling now. And making things. You are moving away from research and physics or to like an engineering problem that needs to get solved. And I think we’re seeing this now, this shift.

[00:08:19] And that we’re getting there.

[00:08:20] Veronica: I think at least from our perspective in working with the media you don’t have to start with this is a classical bit, this is a qubit, this is what a qubit does. And, and so you can start more with modalities.

[00:08:32] It’s not just superconducting, it’s trapped ions or neutral atoms, all the different platforms people are working with. One reason I wanted to talk to you today is because of your LinkedIn posts. I have learned so much about so many different things just from reading your LinkedIn posts. Do you have a special interest in science communication?

[00:08:48] Michaela: Yes. I really enjoy reading and writing and like the combo of it because it deepens your knowledge about the field. And then I think when you just read, it sometimes sticks, but I think the writing process actually makes you digest the information in a different way.

[00:09:07] And also you then pause if you really understood what you read. So yes, I do have an interest in science communication. I find it very rewarding just for myself to get my thoughts down. And I also like all the feedback that I’m getting so far because it seems like it’s helping the community to also learn across and get not just an academic view, but more of a broader view that’s coming from the industrial ecosystem.

[00:09:32] Veronica: Yes. I think your posts definitely have that really nice balance of learning and the basics, but then also putting in the larger context, which is generally what people on LinkedIn are looking for – that business context. So yeah, it’s been really helpful and that feedback is really helpful as well.

[00:09:46] And if you landed the message or not. In addition to some of your explainer posts, you also take a broad view of the industry and it is a global industry. There are companies in Europe and the States and Asia and the Middle East working on these problems.

[00:10:00] You posted recently about geopolitics and, talking with everyone at APS over the last week, it is such a collaborative industry and there’s people from all over the world and from industry and academia. I’m curious about your perspective on this global quantum ecosystem.

[00:10:15] Michaela: This ecosystem really thrives off partnerships. And these partnerships happen on many different scales and with very different partners. If I just look at Quantum Machines, we’re collaborating with academic labs, but also with national labs, startups, and enterprises. So, you really have this broad depth of partnerships.

[00:10:36] And with quantum computing, it’s still a very open ecosystem. It’s a very young field that needs these partnerships. Quantum Machines has more than 20 partners at this point. We also have a very active partnership program. We’re very keen on collaborating with the rest of the field because there are so many obstacles and only together can we really push this field forward and make practical quantum computing happen.

[00:11:02] Veronica: Yes. I hope that approach will persevere and continue. Do you have any advice for people looking to join the industry? Either recent graduates or people trying to decide what to study in college?

[00:11:11] Michaela: It’s a very good question. I feel now this industry gets a lot of hype as well.

[00:11:15] It’s very exciting that there are many young people coming to this field and there are so many angles you can basically take. From hardware to software and doing somehow both. My role also involves both, right? You work with hardware, but hardware is only as good as the software that runs on top.

[00:11:32] So as new students, I think, or as a newcomer to the field, I think a decision that you have to make is maybe, what kind of things you want to focus on – is it really a bit more hardware or software? Because based on that, you can already look at the ecosystem and you find companies and labs that work within these different layers.

[00:11:51] Or just picking, if you’re still a student, picking a lab that works basically on a specific modality and that allows you to see this entire stack. I think also a great foundation then later on is to maybe pick a specific company. And this is already, if you maybe have the physics background.

[00:12:09] I think there are probably many people who are just now getting interested in the field because we’re seeing more popping up in mainstream media. And I think there is lots of room for electrical engineers, software engineers, because we’re going away from something that is made in the lab that we want to bring to an industrial scale.

[00:12:28] And this requires different skills, right? From engineering to business to sales. And there’s so much learning material out there, so many courses. So, I think there’s lots of opportunity for people from any kind of background to enter this field.

[00:12:43] Veronica: In a conversation earlier this week a gentleman I was talking to said he would like to see more experienced classical software engineers in the field, just to bring that perspective and that history into the quantum industry because like you said, it is getting closer to starting to scale up.

[00:12:59] Michaela: And it ties a bit into what I said. So our platform, it’s about hybrid quantum control. And it has this large classical component. For instance, one of our big projects that we’re doing with NVIDIA involves bringing even more classical computing into these quantum workflows.

[00:13:16] And here, of course, we’re also working with classical processing technology. Bringing these types of people in is very beneficial. Like people who know how to do reinforcement learning, how to do machine learning algorithms, right? Very beneficial.

[00:13:31] Veronica: And when you think about that hybrid approach are there like a set of tasks that are typically classical and another set that’s typically quantum?

[00:13:38] Or are you still developing, determining that mix of assignments? I’m curious how the hybrid part is designed.

[00:13:43] Michaela: The quantum operation is basically the operation on the qubit, but the qubit is operated by a pulse, by a microwave pulse. Or a DC pulse. And that is generated classically, right?

[00:13:56] So you only have the quantum operation on a chip when you operate on your physical system. But all the generation, all the readout, all the processing happens in the classical domain. And that’s why we also have the chance and the classical domain to do sophisticated processing using classical techniques.

[00:14:15] So the quantum only actually comes in when you’re at the chip level and everything else is in the classical world.

[00:14:21] Veronica: There’s been so much news recently about chips. Everybody has a chip or is working on a chip or is going to have a chip. And I, when I think of chips, I think of mass production, or that scale that I feel like the quantum industry is getting there, but we’re not quite there.

[00:14:35] I know there are chip designers on your team. Do you think that part of the business will grow over the next few years or not? I’m just curious what your perspective on the whole chip trend, if I may call it that, is.

[00:14:46] Michaela: There are actually already lots of quantum foundries or I think we can see this in many countries, where you want to have a more large-scale industrial scale fabrication. And right now, I think it’s still a bit behind the scenes because even if you have the fabrication techniques, the yield on the individual chips is not as good yet.

[00:15:06] So you have to iterate a lot over it. I think the foundation for doing this industrial-scale manufacturing is building up.

[00:15:15] Veronica: Oh, okay.

[00:15:16] Michaela: But it’s just the output that we’re still waiting for because we need to iterate on the recipes. We need to iterate on the individual chip designs. And this needs to come together, but we’re already building the fundamental building blocks for this, and we will just see more. So probably the yield will increase, the fabrication techniques will improve, and then yeah, in addition, we’re just scaling up, so this needs to go hand in hand.

[00:15:41] Veronica: Right. And it’s, it’s not churning out sneakers or another consumer good, right?

[00:15:45] Some foundries only do a few runs a year, I think. Is that right?

[00:15:49] Michaela: The fabrication techniques for certain qubit platforms are much more sophisticated than standard semiconductor fabrication. And in this case, yeah, you need different tools. And therefore the process is also much slower.

[00:16:02] But I think at this point you can have very fast fabrication flows and you can do testing of many, many chips a week. Oh, okay. And then the problem actually is that if you’re measuring a dilution refrigerator, for instance, it takes much longer actually to load these chips and unload because you always have the warm up of the fridge and the cool down.

[00:16:24] Veronica: Oh, I see.

[00:16:24] Michaela: The fabrication is, I think, not the limiting factor here, but there are other obstacles when it comes to rapid large-scale-testing.

[00:16:32] Veronica: That’s so helpful. I knew there was something I was missing about all of that, so thank you so much for sharing that, that insight.

[00:16:37] As you know, it’s the International Year of Quantum and we’re celebrating a hundred years of quantum mechanics, which is very cool. I’m asking folks to look ahead and when we get to the point of having fault tolerant quantum computers that could do more than classical. Is there a specific use case or a global problem that it just is interesting to you personally that you would take on with a fault tolerant quantum computer?

[00:16:55] Michaela: So I’m a physicist, so of course I’m interested in a lot of physics problems. And what I’m already fascinated by, which is often flying a little bit under the radar, is that we are actually solving physics problems or we’re doing some many body physics on smaller scale qubit systems.

[00:17:15] And I’m excited to see this basically progressing, studying physics with quantum, with qubit systems. And then a little bit maybe further into the future. I’m a big science fiction fan as well, so for me it’s all about material science as well, and maybe material science for simulation of materials molecules. I think that’s what I’m very excited about.

[00:17:37] Veronica: Oh wow. Very cool. Do you have any, I always ask anyone who mentions they’re a science fiction fan, I always ask for movies or book recommendations, anything that you’ve liked recently?

[00:17:45] Michaela: Yes. I’m currently reading “Pandora’s Star” by Peter F. Hamilton. Which I’d like to call popcorn science fiction. It’s a great read. I can highly recommend it.

[00:17:56] Veronica: Alright, good, good. I’m a reader and I appreciate recommendations. I was talking to another scientist and they were saying that the movies and TV shows and books help you imagine the future and that more fiction and imaginative work that can incorporate quantum will help more people understand the potential and the power and the responsibility that come with it.

[00:18:14] Michaela: I completely agree. I think it also gives me a creativity boost when I read about wormholes, in action or some quantum fields and a technology.

[00:18:24] It’s a nice twist to, you know, your everyday life and the physics that I’m interacting with just to really look ahead and it’s very impressive when somebody has this imagination to map out such a world.

[00:18:35] Veronica: Right, I think that’s exactly at that pause in the daily routine to imagine and think about the future.

[00:18:41] It’s been wonderful to talk to you. Thank you so much for your time today and thanks again.

[00:18:45] Michaela: Thank you for having me.

[00:18:46] Thanks for joining us for another episode of The Quantum Spin by HKA. You can find all episodes on our website, hkamarcom.com. Of course you can find us in all your favorite podcast platforms as well. Follow us on LinkedIn under HKA marketing communications.

[00:19:03] If you have an idea for a guest, or if you’d like to be on the podcast yourself, you can reach me on LinkedIn, Veronica Combs, or you can go to our website and share your suggestion via the contact us page. Thanks for listening. Talk to you soon.